My thoughts on the Cry for Justice thing.
It's kind of weird that I didn't end up blogging about this sooner, but since it ended up being the topic of my column, I figured I'd chime in with my own thoughts here.
The whole Hal/Zinda/Helena threesome innuendo amused the heck out of me.
Granted, I don't know if Ollie was serious, but if he was, well...
We ARE talking about Hal Jordan here. And Zinda always struck me as a female version of Hal. This is why I've totally wanted them to knock boots before.
While I have the utmost respect for Gail Simone, I don't really share her concerns about Huntress in all this. Helena's shown her own propensity for making unwise decisions with unsuitable men (how's that for a euphemism?) in comics before. And Hal's, well, the epitome of the "unsuitable man." He's the guy you see across the room and go "DAMN. Bad idea. Totally bad idea. But, DAMN." Sometimes people backslide. And Zinda doesn't seem to be the sort of character that would let something like this effect a friendship, so I can buy that Helena wouldn't be as concerned about that aspect with her as she might with Barbara or Dinah.
Intellectually I can see the concerns about sexism or wish-fulfillment. But well. I can't get too up in arms about what three consenting adult characters do, even if it probably was an exceedingly bad idea. (Since we're talking about heroes here, I think it's safe to assume that the alcohol consumed was not enough to take away consent.)
Oh, and finally, I totally buy Ollie having learned it through Dinah instead of Hal. To indulge in generalizations for a moment: Women TALK. We talk a lot. There is very little a guy does that we do not talk about with our girlfriends. If you get in a fight with your girlfriend and the next day all of her friends seem to be glaring at you...it's because they KNOW. I'm just sayin'. Just because Hal, for some reason, decided not to share it with Ollie doesn't mean that Zinda or Helena wouldn't tell Dinah.
The one thing I don't buy though, is that apparently this story's gone around the superhero community and Hal didn't know. Because that means that Guy Gardner never mocked him about it. And that's just not right, man.
The whole Hal/Zinda/Helena threesome innuendo amused the heck out of me.
Granted, I don't know if Ollie was serious, but if he was, well...
We ARE talking about Hal Jordan here. And Zinda always struck me as a female version of Hal. This is why I've totally wanted them to knock boots before.
While I have the utmost respect for Gail Simone, I don't really share her concerns about Huntress in all this. Helena's shown her own propensity for making unwise decisions with unsuitable men (how's that for a euphemism?) in comics before. And Hal's, well, the epitome of the "unsuitable man." He's the guy you see across the room and go "DAMN. Bad idea. Totally bad idea. But, DAMN." Sometimes people backslide. And Zinda doesn't seem to be the sort of character that would let something like this effect a friendship, so I can buy that Helena wouldn't be as concerned about that aspect with her as she might with Barbara or Dinah.
Intellectually I can see the concerns about sexism or wish-fulfillment. But well. I can't get too up in arms about what three consenting adult characters do, even if it probably was an exceedingly bad idea. (Since we're talking about heroes here, I think it's safe to assume that the alcohol consumed was not enough to take away consent.)
Oh, and finally, I totally buy Ollie having learned it through Dinah instead of Hal. To indulge in generalizations for a moment: Women TALK. We talk a lot. There is very little a guy does that we do not talk about with our girlfriends. If you get in a fight with your girlfriend and the next day all of her friends seem to be glaring at you...it's because they KNOW. I'm just sayin'. Just because Hal, for some reason, decided not to share it with Ollie doesn't mean that Zinda or Helena wouldn't tell Dinah.
The one thing I don't buy though, is that apparently this story's gone around the superhero community and Hal didn't know. Because that means that Guy Gardner never mocked him about it. And that's just not right, man.
posted by kalinara @ 3:48 AM
10 Comments:
At August 09, 2009 5:35 AM,
Saranga said…
Exactly! Zinda and Helena having a one night stand, with Hal, isn't sexist. Both women do know their own mind, do have their own agency and one of them could well have started hitting on Hal first. Neither are particularly shy when it comes to talking to or hitting on men are they?
And yes, women do talk. Of course Dinah would mention something to Ollie, she'd think it were hilarious. I think it's hilarious.
At August 09, 2009 12:57 PM,
SallyP said…
My take on this, is that Zinda and Hal got into a drinking contest, and Hal...lost. Then Zinda and Helena hauled him upstairs, and had their way with him. AND stiffed him for the bill. THAT'S why Hal hasn't wandered around bragging about it to Ollie...which you KNOW that he would.
Of course the girls went back and told Dinah, and Babs too, for that matter, and had quite the giggle about it. When Dinah brought it up to Ollie, he totally misread it...as Ollie would of course. That's why Hal is so startled when he brings it up, because he was hoping to forget the whole thing.
Therefore, there are two sets of rumors going around. The men's version, vs the women's version.
Guy and Kyle HAVE been on Oa, so I imagine that they are missing out on some of the really good gossip. On the other hand, Guy is a friend of Zinda's so he might end up with the TRUE version!
Saranga's right, it IS hilarious.
At August 10, 2009 5:30 AM,
K. D. Bryan said…
Simone's comment about "Starfire having a threeway with Blue Beetle and Booster Gold." just sort of sums up how it feels like they cheapened a friendship for a skeevy joke, IMHO.
Of course, I don't deny that Zinda could Hal would totally be a thing. I always thought Cowgirl was sort of the poor man's Lady Blackhawk. And yes, it's possible Helena might backslide. My problem here is that I just don't see Zinda "Holy Crow! The boy is fancy?!?" Blake and Helena "Grew Up Catholic" Bertinelli deciding to have sexy three-way fun time. Okay, maybe Helena. Maybe. But not Zinda.
Anyhoo, whether we agree to disagree or not, I agree with everyone that it is both very surprising and disappointing that Guy Gardner is not involved. ;)
At August 10, 2009 9:58 AM,
kalinara said…
If anything, given her characterization, I find it more plausible for Zinda.
Disbelief that someone is gay =/= homophobia after all. Especially if she was surprised because she had an eye on him herself. :-P
(I think the one problem with the Starfire/Booster Gold/Blue Beetle comparison is that I think IRL, you're more likely to see casual experimentation with young women than young men. I don't have any stats for this, but society tends to be more forgiving of bisexual or bi-curious tendancies is girls than boys.
Though a Starfire/BB/BG threesome sounds perfectly fine to me too. :-)
Besides, why would it have to cheapen a friendship to know that they would possibly be willing to share a potentially good experience with one another?)
At August 11, 2009 3:50 AM,
James Ashelford said…
Oh, Ted and Booster would totally be up for it. Starfire would proposition them, give them the hotel room keys and head up to the room herself. Those two would think about it for five seconds, Ted would say "Totally worth it.", Booster would nod and off they'd go.
On the other thing: not enough alcohol on earth to rob Zinda of agency.
At August 11, 2009 9:06 AM,
Menshevik said…
The funny thing is that the only other superhero I can think of who was canonically involved in a threesome was innocent Colossus (in a 1970s story later expanded in the Classic X-Men reprint, where two girls in the Savage Land seduced and presumably deflowered him).
At August 11, 2009 9:07 AM,
Menshevik said…
(As an X-Men geek, I can even remember their names, Nereel (mother of Peter, heavily hinted to be the result of this tryst, and later leader of the united tribes) and Fahé (later apparently deceased)).
At August 14, 2009 5:24 PM,
Ferrous Buller said…
Imagine all the things which could happen involving Hal, Zinda, Helena, and a bottle of grappa.
Now imagine all the things which could happen involving Hal, Zinda, Helena, and a bottle of grappa which Hal WOULDN'T brag about.
The great thing about innuendo like this is inventing your own explanations for what REALLY happened. :-)
At August 15, 2009 1:23 AM,
notintheface said…
Am I the only one who can't envision Beetle/Booster/Starfire without thinking of the Courtney Cox episode of "Dream On"?
At August 15, 2009 8:47 PM,
Scott (The Mad Thinker) Anderson said…
I'm with you on this. I get where people could think this was out of character for Huntress or that Robinson is just putting his fantasies into the story, but eh? Some of this just seems like people's odd "sex is bad" hang up making them believe that the characters have been tainted.
Post a Comment
<< Home